Language Access: Fact vs. Fear

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign. [00:00:05] Speaker B: Welcome to Localization today. My name is Eddie Arrieta. I'm the CEO here at Multilingual Media. And today we have a live panel discussion with Mila Golovine from Masterwork, Bruce Adelson from esq, Giovanna Carriero Contreras from AAITE and Bill Rivers, AI. Welcome everyone. [00:00:29] Speaker A: Thank you. Thank you for having us. [00:00:31] Speaker C: Thank you. Thanks. [00:00:38] Speaker D: My name is Mila Galavine and I'm the CEO of Master Word Services. I also wear many hats. In addition to the language services company, I am a part of Women in Localization and I'm one of the founding members of SAFE AI And I am. [00:00:58] Speaker E: Here with my hat of the acting chair and Chair elect of the American association of Interpreters and Translators in Education. As Mila I have a lot of different hats. I am also the founder of Chesko Linguistic Services and I spend my hugely big time on advocacy in language access support in a number of committees and subcommittees for with the main translation and interpreting associations. [00:01:29] Speaker C: And Bill I'm Bill Rivers, principal of W.P. rivers and Associates. Among my many unpaid volunteer roles, I'm the chair of the SAFE AI Task Force. I'm also chair of the new Language Access Coalition which sprang up on March 3rd. And we're going to talk about why it came about. I'm a lobbyist and consultant. I lobby on behalf of the language industry and language access and I do a lot of consulting around language access needs assessments, planning procedures and evaluation of language access. [00:02:03] Speaker E: Bruce hi. [00:02:04] Speaker A: Thank you. Greetings everyone. My name is Bruce Adelson. I'm an attorney living in Maryland where my office is located. I own my own firm only about 10 or 15 miles away from Washington D.C. so you really get to be at the heart of it. I'm a former U.S. department of justice senior trial attorney. I teach at the University of Pittsburgh School of Law and Georgetown University School of Medicine. I have a wide ranging practice, a lot of training, advocacy, litigation, consultation. And today, as you can imagine, the consultation part of my practice has skyrocketed since the inauguration of the current president in January. So with that, again, thank you Eddie very much for the invitation and it is a pleasure to be here today with my colleagues. [00:02:56] Speaker B: Thank you Bruce and thank you everyone else for your introductions. Bruce so business is booming these days. Fantastic news. [00:03:06] Speaker A: Yeah, well, thank you. I think that I have reset my clock to when I was in law school. As far as what hours I keep. It seems to be a never ending stream of pounding away at my computer, writing all kinds of documents and then having meetings like this. So yeah, it's been a pretty interesting time since January 20th. [00:03:31] Speaker B: Fantastic to hear. And our panel brings us to a very energetic and very deep discussion today. And we've titled this panel Trump's Executive Orders and what should I Do? It seems like one is deeper than the other and not the one supposed to be. But at the same time, I'd say we have a task in this conversation from our previous conversations, which is to give enough context to the industry listeners on what the conversation listeners and viewers where this conversation is at. We've seen six, seven, eight different panels and conversations about the executive orders, the consequences of what not. So today we're going to be looking at misconceptions, realities, real pains, examples, what's going to happen with advocacy, but more importantly that we understand what eight of things is. So Bruce, if you could do the honors with this booming business that you're talking about, we might not be want to be in that business. But Bruce, tell us more about what you see the executive orders related to language and the context surrounding those and and any executive orders on on day programs. Thank you so much, Bruce, for your time. [00:04:53] Speaker A: Oh, you're very welcome and thank you. I think that one of the ways to describe what's happening is that we're in, we're in a different world today. The events that are occurring occur on a daily basis almost hour by hour. The changes that are being made and changes that are being attempted are very significant. And I'll start with the executive order that was issued in January that declared English as the official language of the United States. That had never been done in American history before. And then also revoking a executive order from 2000. So a 25 year old executive order that directed federal agencies to figure out how they would provide services to people who are limited English proficient. Among the questions that I still get an awful lot and I talk to my students about this too. What exactly is an executive order? An executive order is not the same as a law. It's not passed by Congress, it's not signed into law by the President. It's not a court decision. Executive orders typically set policy directions and recommendations for the federal government and federal employees. So it's binding on the agencies, it's binding on my former colleagues at the Justice Department, but it's not legally binding on any of us because we don't work for the federal government and we're not federal employees. So this executive order that revoked the 25 year old order, what that means is frankly, not as much as people Think it does. The 25 year old executive order said, okay, agencies, how are you going to provide access to people or lepe? And one of the results of that order was DOJ coming up with guidance in 2002 that explained, okay, we have millions of people who are limited English proficient, who cannot speak or read a language other than English well enough to access government services. So what do we do about that? So DOJ and then other agencies explained, okay, this is what we recommend. This is the best thing to do. But if you're at all like me and you're a real nerd and you read constantly, interrupt with the screen, reading the Federal Register at all kinds of hours, looking at arcane corners of American government, you find some interesting things. The Executive Order does not. Any executive order does not establish any rights, cannot take away any rights. The executive order from 25 years ago did just that. It did not. So if you look in these nooks and crannies of the federal government, you find all these gems, all this information that is unaffected by what the the President signed in January revoking this 25 year old order. There's guidance that is almost the same, almost the same as DOJ's guidance in 2002 that was recently taken away. There are court decisions going back to 1974 that established the federal civil right to language access. Still there. Nothing has happened to it. So I think there is. Understandably, there's a lot of fear and confusion about what this means and what the future is for language access. In part, we don't really know the full answer to that question because there will be more actions from the federal government, more actions from the White House. DOJ will put out more suggestions about how to provide language access. There are many aspects to. If you look at this like a big pizza and you have a big tray that's empty and you start filling it up with slices of pizza, we've just added just a couple of slices to the pan. There is still a lot of room left to add more slices that will explain the story here. But declaring English as the official language of the US making other determinations that are seemingly not harmonious with language access are very concerning. And they send messages to people who are going to be understandably concerned. But going to one of the points of our discussion today, advocacy. This to me is a golden opportunity to explain to people what are your rights, what has happened, what has not happened, what rights do you still have and how do you learn about them and protect them? Because the simple answer is if I were LEP. I have the same rights that I did on January 19, January 21 and yesterday. Are these rights in some jeopardy? I think that that's a logical conclusion. We just don't know yet what will come later on and more things will happen. This is all part of what we lawyers like to call a pattern and practice of activity. We don't really know the full shape yet, but the shape is, I think, inclined to marginalize people, to minimize what their rights are on a daily basis. The administration is disobeying orders from judges, which I learned early in my career. You can't do that. You have to follow what the judge tells you. The administration has been, I know, in Maryland recently deported someone who was not part of the. Was not part of the criminal, alleged criminal gang that the administration made him out to be. So now he's in El Salvador and he has no way of getting home. There are many parts of the puzzle. I tend not. I tend to prefer not to. To speculate and wonder about what's going to happen, except that there will be more uncertainty. There will be a continued, at least symbolic erosion of civil rights, a lot of confusion and misunderstanding about what's actually going on. And again, going back to the. The nerd reading and the nooks and crannies of the government, DOJ puts out occasional announcements about what they're doing, what they plan to do. So what? DOJ recently removed the 2002 guidance about, okay, how do we provide language services? Here are recommendations. They had a nice cool little paragraph that said, hey, you know what, everybody? You're still obligated to provide language services to people who are lep. The law hasn't changed. This is what you have to do. And their restatement of the law was accurate. Now, all right, how many people are actually going to read that, know about it? Not nearly enough, but it's a great advocacy opportunity to explain that. And just as a, as a conclusion for now, we have rights to protect ourselves from the worst aspects of ourselves, the worst aspects that lead people to discriminate against other people. But if the rights are not used, they will disappear, if anything else, just from disuse. So I strongly encourage, and that's what I talk about all the time, learn your rights, understand what they are, invoke your rights, because if you don't, there may come a time when you don't have them anymore. We're not there now, but that could happen sometime in the future. So that's my context. Unsettled. Not changing will it become more unsettled, probably. So really, just hang on, educate yourselves, advocate for yourselves and your communities, and push as hard as you can to make sure that your rights are protected. [00:13:49] Speaker B: Thank you, Bruce. It's a perfect segue to our conversation. One of the things that you are alluding to is the misconceptions, the things that people believe happened or need to happen because of the executive order. Just hearing that there is an executive order that says English is the official language, what it does to the understanding of what you mentioned, policy direction, those misconceptions can lead to them, misinterpretations. And then you just have civil rights eroded everywhere and citizens that don't believe in the institutions, institutions that don't speak with the citizens. And then that erosion on paper just looks like you just revoked something that was supposed to do nothing, but it did so much in the psyche of the entire society that it did transform something that's a civil right. So, Bill, could you tell us a bit about how this takes place? What are some of the misconceptions that could be very dangerous to continue believing in, and what are some realities that we have to be concerned about? [00:15:03] Speaker C: So thank you, Eddie, and I'll just start, I think, picking up on a couple of threads of what Bruce said. The executive orders, yes. They bind only the executive branch. If you work for the federal government, you are now obligated to call it the Gulf of America. I don't have to call it that. There is a Board of Geographic Names entity that decides on what goes on the map. And we're not obligated to call it the Gulf of America. I could rename it the Gulf of Bill. And you're not obligated to call it that. Right. And that's a very kind of glib and facile way of saying that if you understand the four corners of the paper, as it were, within executive order, you're already well ahead of most of the citizenry and the population of the United States. The executive order that declared English the official language, which I actually think was the last, like the last day of February or first day of March, there have been so many, and it still has enormous symbolic weight. And I'm going to start a little bit there because there's a misconception that it's. Oh, it's just acknowledging the obvious. English is the de facto language and it doesn't threaten anyone. Well, the English only movement, the English first. And it's a. Not a very. When you look it up, and it's organizations Founded by a noted eugenicist, John Taunton, by people much into white supremacy and very nativist. And that we, you know, that don't accord well with my own personal beliefs and value system, let me put it that way, and I suspect with a great many other peoples. So, yes, it's symbolic, but that symbolism carries power. And when we, when we step back and say, okay, you've got this executive order, and it's revocation of another executive order, which, okay, we can get, we can go all like, you know, legal language access nerds and talk about how we're just rearranging chairs on the deck of a, you know, fictitious ship. But there's a whole bunch of other executive orders related to the enforcement of various immigration policies, that changes at the border collusion. And then you have to add to that the actions that the government is taking on a very rapid pace. As Bruce noted, on a daily, even hourly basis, entire offices like the Office of Minority Health disappeared. Monday evening, Tuesday morning, it didn't exist. Monday, March 31, it didn't. Tuesday morning, April 1, it did. March 31, Tuesday morning, it didn't. Webpage is gone. Everybody's fired. Legal, it's created by statutes, by law, by Congress Appropriations bill, but nevertheless, it has been eliminated. And that's happening over and over and over again. We saw the Department of Education, Office of Civil Rights lose a significant number of its people and have a number of the regional offices shut down. We saw the Office of English Language Acquisition at the Department of Education provided the sort of engagement in the office, in the educational space. We saw the Office of Civil Rights, it's actually called CRCL at the Department of Homeland Security, but we saw that office eliminated. And that was the office that oversaw language access and enforcement. And so we're seeing all this. We're seeing grants eliminated for research of the provision of language access. Now, part of me says we already kind of know that, but it's also always good to get new data. But those are happening on a daily basis. And so my concern is that while all of this is going on, we're losing the enforcement arm. We're losing much of the enforcement capability that the federal government has to ensure language industry. Because language access is a significant vertical in the US Language industry, especially in interpreting. We still have the courts, and I would sit state governments systems and local educational agencies are going to be much more. So that's there. And then there's the reality that, you know, when you, when. When half of the center for Medicaid and Medicare Services staff have been laid off, payments slow down and hospitals and healthcare systems aren't getting paid on time, you know, and those payments weren't always very efficient in the before time. And so now they're holding back on paying their vendors, which means they're interpreting and translation service. Seeing this impact in a system where yet there V Next to the law of the land, that's the 1974 unanimous national origin that you discriminate based on language status still the law of land title 6 still the law of land. Section 1557 of the Patient and Affordable Care act aka above the land, the regulation that implements that is still the law of the land. But I'm concerned about the enforcement mechanisms and I'm concerned about, and I'm concerned about the chilling effect obviously that you know, we're seeing anecdotal evidence and now some leading indicators, for example certain indigenous languages and we're seeing higher utilization rates in outside of normal business hours for healthcare companies. Healthcare providers are seeing where. What we think that means is people are going to the ER instead of going to the primary care physician and they're showing up at 8:00 or 9:00 at night or on the weekend when they're really sick instead of getting things taken care of in the regular course of going to your doctor. But at the same time as we have a civil rights discriminate, we have the moral, in my view the moral obligation to do the right thing to provide people access to healthcare, to education, to the legal system. But there's the very pragmatic issue that you can't, you can't treat the patients, individuals cannot participate meaningfully in the legal system, litigants, defendants, if they can't understand the proceedings, that they're very pragmatic reasons that we will still have language access, that we had language access before 2166, before section 1557 and we will continue to have language access no matter what this administration, which is, which is very avowedly and distinctly anti immigrant and you know, white nationalist and whatever you want to call it. And I'm, I'm just putting it out there, I'm going to go to Canada. I hope I get back in the country again. But those pragmatic reasons are still there and that means, and for those reasons we're still going to have language access. [00:22:57] Speaker B: Thank you, Bill. And this gets us closer from what it is said and what's possible and then what perceptions are changing in such a way, then what you mentioned, enforcement mechanisms weaken and then the things that are supposed to be obvious and that everyone should be doing, no longer do them or they don't have any clear penalties, in which case just become like we would say in Colombia. Dogs without teeth will be our expression here when we, when we see something like that. But to talk a little bit more about these, we probably have to talk to those in the front lines and see what's happening in real terms in numbers and also in the pains that we have in the conversations that are going on. So for that we have Mila Golovine, your founder and CEO of masterward, and Giovanna Carriero Contreras from A I T E. Mila, let's start with you. What do you see and what can you say in this conversation? [00:24:00] Speaker D: Well, what I want to add is also, while English is really one of the dominant languages in the US if we really look at the United States and the history, it's a country of immigrants, right? And we came here, the immigrants came here. And there is a lot of indigenous languages that are here. So and actually, some states recognize, like the state of Hawaii recognizes Hawaiian language as an official language. I believe Alaska recognizes some other indigenous languages. So I think we want to see where languages, other languages are being recognized because many countries recognize many languages spoken there as languages. But what's happening on the ground is people took it, in a way, taking it a little bit too far. Same as during COVID there was suddenly visible discrimination against people of Chinese origin at a certain point. And same as during 9 11, there was visible discrimination against people with Middle Eastern origin. Right now, there is a visible discrimination against anybody who is an immigrant. Yes, I am wholeheartedly for cleaning up the streets and removing the gangs and the drug cartels. And yes, they've been operating here pretty much without any punishment. I hope they get the punishment they deserve and we stop the drugs and crime that is happening in this country. But at the same time, they're also victims of human trafficking that are afraid to call today because they don't know they're protected. They don't know they may get a protected visa status. They didn't come, many of them didn't come to this country willingly. They were brought in as part of being trafficked. They're victims of domestic violence that don't call because they're just afraid to call. They may be of a different ethnic origin. We're also taking it too far in terms of people are just like Bill said, not presenting themselves to hospitals, not showing up except for the emergency room. But at the same time and I'm sure Giovanna will talk about it and I'll leave it up to you, Ivan. Talk about how it affects schools. But there are very many people in this country who, who don't speak English as their primary language. And many of them are lawyers, professionals, artists, people who walk all walks of life and people who bring all kinds of value to this society. And currently it's affecting the field. There's a lot of number one discrimination, like I mentioned, also lack of language access being provided. And then organizations are going, oh, here you are, you can use ChatGPT instead. But I'm also seeing some increased discrimination even against people who are deaf and hard of hearing. And the executive order didn't cancel their language access at all. And nobody questioned if they were born in this country or a part of the, you know, whatever cartel that came, came here. But I'm hearing and I'm seeing examples where deaf access is not provided either. So I think as a society it has affected us in a negative way. I think there is a lot of collateral damage that is happening. And I hope that as a country and as people, we end up in some form of middle ground for that and that we end up protecting human rights at the end. [00:27:58] Speaker B: Thank you, Mila. Giovanna, what do you see? [00:28:02] Speaker E: What do I have to add to all of this is that I think we have a fundamental misunderstanding about what made and makes America great. So I, as an immigrant, I had to learn a lot of things when I came here. I was privileged that in some shape or form I spoke English. So for me the adaptation was a little bit more, it was a little easier than others. And in that way I feel privileged. However, what is that really drives to this country? And if you look at the freedom at the Bill of Rights, this country is great for the freedoms that it allowed. What I mean by that is there are some most basic freedoms and right that are key ideas in each amendment of the Bill of Rights. And particularly what America is great for is the freedom of religion, the freedom of speech, the freedom on the press, the freedom of assembly. All of this at the moment are threatened for lack of better term. I think to take from what Bruce said, this is a great opportunity for people to advocate, particularly in language access areas. It's even a greater opportunity for interpreters and translators to be able to use what they know how to do best, use their language skills. On one side. I think the number one item that we have to check off on our to do is to get educated, to get informed, as both Bill and Bruce said, there is a lot of information out there, but there is also a lot of confused information that creates a lot of disruption. And I take these two words that have been used over and over and over, and they are becoming my tagline. Why? Because the administration is creating a lot of confusion. The reason why these changes are coming by the minute is because we, we cannot catch our breath. And so the very first thing is that don't panic. The first thing is let's, let's understand what's happening and let's start getting into a more of reflexive and proactive mode rather than reactive. Get educated, get informed, go to the right sources. A lot of what we read in the media can be contradictory, can be not truthful. And I think they're really starting with the clarity that Bruce used in the very beginning. We still have rights. Those have not been wiped off yet. And these are what we need to go back to, to build our strategy on, to build actions that can have the purpose to advocate in the right way. This is the time to really tune and hone into our best skills to create effective communication strategies, effective ways to keep up with that communication. And so if I, I am a very pragmatic person. I always think, okay, I go to people like Bruce, like Bill, to learn and to clarify my doubts, my confusion, and then I go read, come back with questions. But I am also a very pragmatic person. I want to know I, as an individual, as a citizen or a resident, I want to know what I can do to better situation. And I can start with my little circle. I don't have to be to any podcast or any webinar to contribute to change. And that's what we all need to understand. In another venue, one of our colleagues stated very, very clearly, if we are talking on behalf of 26 billion people that do not speak a second language, we should have 26 billion stories to share because each one of us gets affected. And so continuing on the line of being very pragmatic and to understand what we should be doing, maybe I would like to consider some of the things that we can do in order to contribute in our little circle. And again, it's very important that we understand that we can all have a part in this movement in a way that makes me feel as an immigrant part of history, because people behind me have fought for rights. And we are now at the moment where we have to fight in. What we believe in, in our case in this venue, is language access. And language access is threatened by a lot of the changes that the administration is putting out. Look at the associations that you're part of and they can be tni, translation and interpreting, but it can be some other type of organizations that do grassroot for those that are already exposed to grassroots activities. You may already be aware of some of the items that I bring up here in terms of pragmatic advocacy and action items. But if you do, then bring them back and share with others within your community and help others to do the same work that you have been doing in other venues. So first of all, I said do not panic. Do not make reactive decisions. Go back to the mission, go back to the purpose, go back to the vision statements of your organization, the profession, the groups that you belong to, and review the current practices. First of all, do not reactively change what has worked for you well, but what has not worked, then try to adapt it to what is now the status quo. Collect data. We need to have more data on how the present changes are affecting our people, our communities, friends, families, teachers. I mean I, I am maybe going to talk more to the education because this is what our association focuses on. But the same conversation can be applied to any other community. Service, social services, healthcare. The principle is the same. What is that is happening to your communities is about culture, is about the languages, is about funding. We need stories, we just don't need empirical what if form focus groups with your people, with your circles, with your organizations. You also, of course, I do not want to be naive in saying we all fear the funding cuts. Let's be creative, let's be creative on how we can re submit funding requests and how we can reshape some of our processes, internal processes, to apply for more funding. This is the time to eliminate internal inefficiencies and so the review of certain processes, having more hands on deck, it's vital. And it's time also to open a little bit more to technology, to automate some of the processes. And I know where you're going when I say technology, everybody will talk about AI. Well, AI is something out there to embrace. And I will never ever, ever say that AI should replace any of the work that we do. But it can may be automated, some data collection, for example, it could maybe speed up some surveys that we can send out, the organization of some focus groups to assess and analyze data. There are several other ways that we can use the technology that we have out there. Language access is not a luxury item. It should be a right to all. And so we can no longer talk about whether or not we can afford it because we cannot afford not to have it because the lack of language access for a number of our communities means a lot of other problems. They are going to wait on the social services system, on mental health system. So if we create some gaps in one area, we're. We're truly going to have problems on other areas. Let's look closer at the laws that we have because if you look for example at the laws about disabilities, there are a lot of our communities, a lot of our students that do receive funding through those. And what if they're not provided? What is the unintended consequences? This is also what it means. We collect data. Data. Any unbalances in one side will create unintended consequences on others. And we already have histories, especially in schools, to assess that. Because schools are actually the places where every problem comes in. If you have problems at the house, if you have problem at the, in health problems, disability problems, sooner or later it will get to the school connected with your professional associations. This is really the time where we need you all. American Translators Association, national association of Judiciary and Interpreter Translators, American association of Interpreters and Translators in Education. There are also the certification association. We need all hands on deck. And just to get another plug, AIT is going to have coming up soon a very interesting get together where we are going to dive more into these type of actions. Collect storytelling. Storytelling are powerful. Now once we collect all of this, what do we do with it? Start sending everything to our congress people. We need to make them hear us. We need them to know that we have a voice. And the voice of one does not make much noise, but the, the voice of many singing the same song is going to be a beautiful choir. Is there anything else that any of my friends here would like to add? [00:40:20] Speaker B: Thank you, Giovanna. I think it's great. It's a great closure for this first section of the panel. I want to remind everyone who is listening to this that we are in a live conversation in the panel. Trump's executive orders and what should I do? We have Bill Rivers from safe, AI, Bruce Adelson from esq, Mila Golovina from Master Award and Giovanna Carriero from aaite. And of course we all agree on language access being the sophisticated, very sophisticated function that allows for the adoption of great talent from many different places. You have a greatest localization diasporas around the US that receive Colombians and Mexicans and any Latin American nation is very well represented in the United States and that allows for a lot of immigrants to adapt to these new environments. So I think we agree that having more of that is a sophisticated function that allows for the north to be as great as it is. I love to explore a bit more on the fragment pains, Bill, that you have some opinions on this and that there will be more pain. Could you tell us a bit more of the shape that pain is going to take in the future? [00:41:48] Speaker C: So sure. And I'll start with one of the misconceptions that Giovanna kind of brought up. With the exception of partial reimbursement under Medicaid, which is the program for health care for the low people with low income, partial language access reimbursement under Medicaid, which I think 13 states accepted when that program was rolled out 15 years ago or 10 years ago. The federal government doesn't fund language access. Federal government does not fund language access. The principle under civil rights law is that you're just not, you're not supposed to discriminate. You don't get extra money for doing the right thing. You don't get extra money for. You're not discriminating. You're just not supposed to discriminate. If you receive federal funds now in the real world, it becomes an unfunded mandate. And I say that because with respect to language access, communications access for the deaf and hard of hearing, the blind, as well as mobility and other types of access for the disabled, you can put a price tag on that a lot easier than you can put a price tag on the cost of not being a racist or an anti Semite or a nativist or whatever. But you don't, you don't get paid extra to not discriminate. You just got to do it and it comes out of, you know, comes out of overhead. Now we also know that the provision of language access results in the, in the more efficient and more impactful delivery of services. And we've got 30 plus years of reset in healthcare. So I just want to say that, you know, there's a myth out there. Federal government's paying for this. They ain't paying for it. You just have to do it. If you, if you're talking about the, the pain, I think I'm at the ground level, what I'm, what I'm seeing and, and, and Mila and Giovanna can, can fill this in as well. That, that the pain is coming from the, the challenges that the, the system is ha. For example, the healthcare system is having now with delayed reimbursement or the educational system where, you know, half the department of Education has been laid off. And now the funds that go into the state education agencies and then into the local school districts are coming at a slower rate. And that makes it harder for the clients of our language access providers to pay their bills. And I think that's like the very practical thing we're seeing now, in addition to the chilling effect that everything is having on immigrants showing up for healthcare or for other social services or putting their kids in school. But I think that's the immediate thing. And I just want to come back to another point too. Alaska has 21 official languages, 20 Alaska Native languages plus English. New Mexico has Spanish as well. 75 million plus Americans speak a language other than English home. 26 million are linguistically isolated or limited English proficient. More than 800 immigrant languages in the United States. A recent survey, a book called Language City by a fellow named Ross Perlin, A survey in New York City, 800 plus in New York City alone. You add to that 150 or more native American languages who are incredibly linguistically diverse. And that's part of what drives the US Language industry, certainly on the language access side and to no small measure on the translation and localization side, because American companies want to sell to that, you know, to the 60 million Latinos in the United States and they do a lot better selling in culturally and linguistically appropriate ways. Right. None of that's really going to change. And I come back to, okay, the funding slowed down. People are scared to go to see their doctor, scared to send their kids to school. Right now we don't know how that's going to work out. And there's reason to be scared and there's reason for uncertainty. But the fundamentals underlying it all, you know, you still have to provide that, still have to provide language access, civil law, and there's all sorts of really important pragmatic reasons to do it. Pragmatic and bottom line reasons to do it. [00:46:01] Speaker B: Thank you, Bill. And of course, we were jokingly mentioning that business is booming for Bruce, but of course, this also has a pragmatic approach from the work that needs to be done in advocacy for the awareness that needs to be around the pain points that this is bringing. A Bruce, you believe that there are language services to be offered and that those services need to be provided. Push even further that there is a lot of work to be done. What do you see and what do you think needs to happen? [00:46:36] Speaker A: Well, I think that, that that's a really interesting point and angle to all of this because I think that one, one of the realities that gets overlooked. And let's be very frank about this. Over the last 25 years, it's not as if 100% of hospitals were providing language services. They and that the United States was a beacon of language services as far as it needs to be provided. That's just not true. And with the federal government having actually done the enforcement when I worked at doj, federal enforcement has always been underfunded. The offices that enforce these laws are understaffed. We used to get dozens of complaints weekly, several daily, that we were never able to get to just because of the massive number of complaints. What's important to remember? Well, there are a lot of things that are important to remember, that all the things that have been happening since Inauguration Day have created a certain climate and atmosphere of fear, uncertainty, confusion. And it's very serious. And I think that that's part of the overall issue that people really just don't know yet what's going to happen. I have a child who has a disability, for example. What will happen when he returns to school in the fall? What will happen for the rest of this school year? What will happen with states who are just sued yesterday in federal court in Rhode island to stop the funding eliminations? At the Department of Health and Human Services? The only part of the United States government that's working now fully are the courts. We have the executive branch, the legislative branch, the judicial branch. The legislative branch is Congress. Congress is. Is doing whatever they're told by the White House. The executive branch, obviously, is the one that is putting out all of these policies. The only branch that is following the law for the most part are the courts. They've stopped some funding eliminations. They've ordered the rehirings of thousands of workers. They've stopped certain policies from being implemented. But the courts don't act immediately. It's not like I could call up a judge and say, judge, I need you to do this right now. It doesn't work like that. But I think that as far as advocacy in general and education in general, that emphasizes this issue with language access, that's part of what we can achieve in court. But I think what's also important, Eddie, is all the people that I talk to, whether they're clients or otherwise, hospitals, state governments, city governments, courts, all of them, 100% of them are providing the language access they provided earlier this year. And their reaction is, why would we stop doing that? We're used to it. It's important. It works for us. We will continue to do that. But I think, as you've already heard, as we've all heard, there are issues about funding. Will the funding continue? Where will X State get money to provide language access to jails, prisons, police departments? So that is a real concern and that's something we don't know how that's going to shape out yet. I suspect there may even be some lawsuits about that too in the future. But the people on the ground, the institutions that are required to comply with the law, as I said from 100% of the people I talk to, they're still doing that. But this is an opportunity, as Giovanna so eloquently described, to educate not only individuals, communities, but these organizations about what they're currently required to do this. I like to look at certain happenings as opportunities for change. This is a ideal opportunity to kind of turn things around, empower people with correct, accurate information, let them go to their community hospital and explain why language access is needed, why it's required, why it's not an option. All the things that we've talked about, we have a crucible moment in a way that we should use to inform, enlighten and empower efforts to not only preserve language access, which as Bill said, language access isn't going anywhere. Language access will remain the law for untold numbers of years, but a lot of people don't know that. And I think that now is the time when there is so much fear and uncertainty that they do. So that's something that I do regularly every week now I'm in my law school semester. Every week we talk about this and educating future lawyers about what rights people have and how to go about ensuring that the rights are protected. [00:52:20] Speaker C: Thank you. [00:52:21] Speaker B: Bruce and Mila, you did have some to say. You do see the gaps of the work that still needs to be done. Could you tell us a bit more from your perspective what opportunities and also challenges we have with have. [00:52:36] Speaker D: I wanted to add one more comment before that. One of the things we're seeing on the ground is hospitals losing funding and cutting staff, doctors, medical staff as a result, not one isolated case, but number of cases and hospitals having difficulty also with fundings. So I think that is going to affect not just limited English proficient population. I think that's going to affect everybody. They come to hospital and there is no doctor. So that's a, that's a big concern there. I think another thing that we can do well, join the movement in a way. You know, there's all of the, for those who are working in, in the field, join, join the movement work. You Know, there's groups within American Translators association, ait, you know, SAFE AI and all of the other, you know, people. People need help. So join the advocacy movement and ELC organizes, you know, a way to talk to your representatives. I think I completely agree with Jeron and want to restate that, collect stories and send them to your representative. People die. I've heard of a recent case when actually AI was used for a 911 call. And when you do machine interpreting, it blacks out noise, right? It mutes the noise and only interprets what was interpreted. And what happened was it did not alert the deputies. Walking in the background noise was actually violence. And as a result, they walked into a situation where it was violent, somebody ended up being hurt. And actually, the cost there, because there's no investigation and all kinds of other things cost, there's a lot higher. So there's a lot of other challenges with not providing language access that, that we know. And if you want to just look at it from not the civil right, but from the commercial and purely enterprise, you know, we have that coined phrase, can't read, won't buy. And it actually does work that way. So if you want to reach out to the consumers, right, You. You want to reach out and the language of the consumer. So be active, get involved. This is the time not to sit at home and not to complain about this in the privacy of your home, but it's the time to get out and join the movement. [00:55:06] Speaker B: And these movements have different shapes from forms. They are happening in different places. Giovanna, we were talking off the recording about some of the actions that are coming up. We understand that SAFE AI is actively involved in many of these conversations. What can each of you tell us about the opportunities that you've seen out there for industries to get involved, for companies to get involved, for professionals to get involved, for the international community to get involved. Magazines like Multilingual to get involved. And of course, let us know what you have in that to say. [00:55:45] Speaker E: I would start with saying that, like, in any space, in any situation, at any moment throughout the human history, changes are always either offering opportunities or challenges, right? Technology right now at this juncture is it can be either extremely helpful or extremely detrimental. Where I think that our industry can come together is really to uncover the detriment that the use of. In the inappropriate use of technology can cause to humans. Taking back from the example that Mila just brought up, making an inappropriate use of certain technology put human lives in danger. And it makes me think of two main things. One, we need to bring these stories to surface, we need to share these stories and analyze these stories because one, they are never isolated. It must have happened somewhere else and we must have not heard of it. Two, communication is a very human driven activity. We communicate in many more ways that technology can even think. And I, frankly speaking, don't even want to think of those that say in 10 years the machine will be smarter than me. It's not only about me being smart. I am so many more things, just smart. I relate to people, I care for people. The machine is not going to care for me. Three, as an industry, we need to redefine the best practices, redefine those moral values that Bill was talking about, and live by them. [00:58:06] Speaker B: Thank you. Anyone else wants to participate? If not, how can people voice their needs? How can people get involved? How can people protect their rights? [00:58:15] Speaker C: Bill, so this, someone said it earlier in the conversation. It might have been Giovanna. You need to plug into your professional community to your peer group. Whether you're a practitioner or you're a company owner, you're a lawyer, you're going to have a local regional association to join. You're going to have a national association to join. And they're the ones where you're going to, where you're going to be able to compare notes to get support from your peers. And organizations like the alc, like aai, te are like the ata, are organizing to support advocacy. You know, you're not alone if you're in the industry. And I do a lot of work with the language industry. I know Giovanna and Mila are both owners of companies. You know, you've got to talk to your peers, you've got to make sure you're diversified, et cetera. But plug in, right? Get educated, plug in, be ready to take action. Because there are, you know, there are folks like us who are out there, you know, who are going to help, help you take that action. [00:59:22] Speaker E: And I also want to add one more thing to that is everybody needs to understand that all the work that we do on association is volunteer on a volunteer basis. So everybody on these screen does devote a number of hours, depending on the need to all our professional efforts that they have nothing to do with our paid jobs. And what I often hear is I don't have time. Everybody has time to complain. If all those that complain take an hour of their time, the load will be much easier for those that instead take that as, as, as, as, I don't know, professional moral value duty. You call it however you want because the Reality is that there is a lot of work done and when more than us bear the burden, then the burden is lighter and we can advance faster. So volunteering, reaching out to associations does not mean that you have to have a second full time job. It means that you devote what you can at your highest competence so that you can provide the help and the assistance that is needed for others. [01:00:35] Speaker A: And Eddie, if I could just jump in quickly. I teach advocacy. Lawyer in French is avoca. I'm a professional avocado. That means I'm an advocate and a lawyer when I teach advocacy both in university and to professional organizations. Identify the win. What win are you looking for? Make sure it's pragmatic and doable. And I'm not going to suggest any particular win, but you put together a strategy where you will win and achieve what it is you want to achieve. You know at some point that people have to like, get off, get off the deck, get off the chair, get involved, particularly in this country of immigrants that we're from. Particularly in my situation where my family came here 100 years ago, they couldn't speak English. I've dealt with, worked with Native American communities and Alaska Native communities. I understand what it's like to be born here and not speak English. So advocate for the win. Pragmatic. Get that goal that you want. The goal may be easier to attain than you think it is. [01:01:54] Speaker B: Any final thoughts to our audience? Any things that you believe should not be left on set? [01:02:02] Speaker D: Well, I think the big why, right? It's not just the right thing. It's not just the language access. It's also in addition to that, it's access to opportunity. For example, when parents are not involved in kids education, the kid may speak English, but the parent may not speak English. When kids are not involved, we have a lot of research that shows that the child is more likely to drop out of school. So we, we have a choice. We have a choice on so many levels and each one of us will have their own why. But we have a choice of standing up for a greater community and we have a choice of retreating and watching just things happen, affecting people. As long as it doesn't affect me, I'm okay. So I think the big why is out there and the big why is pretty obvious. [01:03:06] Speaker E: I'm going to add one more thing. Legacy. In four years from now, six years, 10 years, 15 years, do you want to look back and think that you were sitting somewhere on the sideline or you were there and made a change? I don't know how to make the change alone. But that's why I'm together with this community. [01:03:25] Speaker A: And I would add to that that all of the things we've talked about are headed straight for the US Supreme Court that has the potential to change American life as we know it. So one of my wishes is, you know what, learn about the courts and how they work, learn a little bit about the law, go watch court proceedings, learn about this. Because someday, either this year or next, it's all coming to the Supreme Court and that the results may make this a completely different country than it is today. [01:04:02] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:04:04] Speaker B: And once that happens, we'll be happy to have another catch up with you, see where the conversation is at, hoping the business is booming for everyone. But that of course, having a more, let's say, inform and society that allows them to understand what the instruments for citizenship are, what to do with those instruments and why those give us more power than what one might think. [01:04:30] Speaker D: I want to thank you. I want to have one more thing to add. And years ago I was, you know, something else was happening in America and people were saying, oh, this is wrong and this is wrong and this is wrong. And a person who, who was. [01:04:50] Speaker A: Who. [01:04:50] Speaker D: Grew up in the Soviet Union, a much older person who grew up in the Soviet Union, told me, count your blessings as long as you live in the country where you have the worst government or the worst president in history, regardless of whether they're Democrats or Republicans. Because if you find yourself with 100% approval rating, you find yourself in North Korea. Korea. So I think with all said and with all of the discourse happening, the fact that in this country we can disagree in this country we have the ability to speak up. That's a great privilege. And so I just want to finish on, on that note. [01:05:34] Speaker B: And this was our live conversation, the panel on Trump's executive orders. And what should I do? Understanding a bit more about the executive orders that affect language services, what that actually means for citizens and the deeper conversation on what it is that we could do and should be doing as active citizens of the world. We hope our listeners, our listeners are Bill Rivers from SAFE AI. Thank you so much for joining us. [01:06:05] Speaker C: My pleasure. [01:06:05] Speaker B: Bruce Adelson, E. AQ Business booming. I will not forget that. Thank you so much for joining us. [01:06:11] Speaker A: Thank you so much, Eddie. [01:06:13] Speaker B: Absolutely. Ludmila Mila Golovine from Master Word. Thank you, Mila, as always. Giovanna Carriero Contreras A A I T E thank you for, for doing this, Giovanna. [01:06:25] Speaker E: Thank you for having us. [01:06:27] Speaker B: And to all of our listeners. Thank you so much for sticking around. This was another episode of Localization today. My name is Eddie Rieta. I'm the CEO here at Multilingual Media. Until next time, goodbye.